An appetising, nutritious, numeric snack that boils down the week’s news, by David Clark
120 - Million dollars to merchant bankers by the Nats to pawn our state assets.
80 - Per cent of New Zealanders ignored by National on asset sales.
20 - June: the date the Mixed Ownership Model Bill would have passed had Labour not fought for our assets.
7 - The number of times Energy Minister Phil Heatley was told off in Parliament for failing to answer a simple question on power prices.
1 - Absent conscience when it comes to keeping his election promise never to sell off our water assets.
maybe some other numbers to remember why Labour is in opposition
86% against the anti-smacking bill
$600,000,000 the amount Cullen spent on his trainset
$120,000 – the annual income you can have and still recieve working for families
$10b – the amount Cullen over taxed new Zealanders (and then managed to spend the whole lot
10 years – the 2008 PREFU forecast on Deficits leftby the Labour Government (before earthquakes and the GFC really kicked in.
At this point it time i think I would prefer to trust the guys who know how to run the economy rather that Labour (and the Greens ) based on the track record of each
How much do you think would be required to effectively sell the assets and realise the best possible price? I presume you know that there will always be some cost of sale.
United Future didn’t “promise” anything, they (we) campaigned on a range of policies, and after the election negotiated what they could in a coalition agreement. That’s how things work.
There are a lot of things Labour “promised” to do during the election campaign, and they have not delivered. Why not?
There are a lot of things Labour “promised” to do during the election campaign, and they have not delivered. Why not?
Dear Pete,
In order to deliver on promises, Labour has first to regain the treasury benches. Its likely to happen in 2014, so you don’t have long to wait,
cheers
Anne
Dear Anne
In order to deliver most priority policies, United Future has first to gain a LOT more seats, otherwise it will have to negotiate what bits it can.
And Labour will have to negotiate common policy ground with Greens and maybe NZF and whover else is needed, which will mean they won’t be able to deliver on all their “promises”.
(I’ve seen very few actual election promises made).
Cheers
Pete
BTW, I don’t recall Labour promising to extend their campaigning with a petition.
@Pete George – oh your poor party, pushed into a corner by the Nats.
You would have thought – if Dunne wanted to increase his party’s share of the vote, and hence take more of his members into Parliament – the SoE sales might turn out to have been a pretty big concession to have made, since they will have depended on his vote.
But nope – a short-term approach from your leader to cling to the baubles of power. A man thought to be so adept at divining the “middle ground/common sense/FAMILIES” approach, and he decides to roll with legislation opposed by 80% of the country!
Too bad for you, after 2014 he and your party will be Dunne and dusted.
What is Labour’s position on buy back of the assets 80% of the people want to retain in full public ownership?
If people buy the assets knowing Labour’s position in advance, that is fair warning.
So is it buy back of the assets at the sale price as per NZ First?
I asked Peter Dunne about this and he clarifies.
What we were essentially referring to was privatisation of high country rivers, lakes etc that would lead to restrictions on public access.
We were not talking about hydro dams, for example, so Labour’s attempts to hook this into the MOMs debate is at best specious, at worst dishonest. If one looks at our overall approach to preserving public access, the overall policy fits into place neatly.
Clayton has picked out comments without considering the whole context – along with comments about water rights (which were admittedly a bit vague – it was clear United Future looked at the power companies separately.
United Future’s election video stated this:
“We say there are three key assets that should never be sold: Kiwibank, Radio New Zealand and our Water”.
As “our water” was said, a tap appeared. I don’t know about anyone else, but I took that to mean that water should not be privatised. As in, New Zealanders should never have to pay a private company for the water coming out of their tap. I see Pete George has clarified this to mean something different above, but either way, the link to energy companies and hydro dams is tenuous at best.
What kind of job opps does that $120,000,000 for goldman sacs open up for the PM’s relies….. I’m sure there’s a few young Key’s keen to take up the family trade (pardon the pun).
Or is John Key a real partiot kiwi?
Oh no.. little pete has found a new outlet for his self promotion, and shilling practice …..
Making a virtue out of pete badhairs weaseling around his dishonest campaigning won’t convince any but the already lost…
Attempting to sound erudite whilst doing no more than pointing out the bleeding obvious regarding the discussions necessary to create a government that is effective..(as well as re-instituting the principle of “duty of care”, which united future has so obviously abandoned for the sake of power)is , quite frankly, playing silly word games with ones self…….
The only positive that can be taken from this, is that, if the only argument against what is being posted on here by the authors is self absorbed, defensive, party political grandstanding, then we can be assured that the points made by those authors has, not only merit, but exposes actions by the ruling cabal that don’t have the greater good of new zealanders at heart…..
What is the replacement cost of the assets that are going to be sold for say Mighty River and Meridian, selling these assets for chickenfeed is just stupidity.
However Roger Douglas was knighted for his stupidity.
Logic has been thrown out the window.
Evidently we sold Telecom for $4 Billion and it was worth $24 Billion, I hope they have got the valuations right on these power generating assets.
I doubt we could rebuild them for the price they are being sold for.
BNZ is a classic example of a Government selling a strategic asset which turned into a mess under private ownership. Then we somehow had to bail it out then pass the ownership over to National Bank of Australia. Our knights Sir Ron Brierly and Sir Michael Fay were directors at the time.
JKey works for US/EU corporate and family bankers. The term “relatives” has some merit but he is in there with them.
The conservative minds on this forum ignore that and just are unable to view the bigger picture.
Equity on terms of shared wealth is a joke with the bottom 50% of NZ population having their share at 12% a few years ago now trimmed down to less than 3% and falling. Guess where its all going.
You will not be thanked in any way for your pathetic defense of this oligarchy.
@Pete George – you can play all the semantics games you like, but the right to remove water from its natural water systems, including that life that relies upon it, stockpile it, and then release it to profit at the expense of others will soon be a privatised use of water.
Just who does your leader think he is kidding?
sorry about that
The Sale of State Assets reduces the Net Equity Position of NZ Inc. and the loss of the dividend streams from these Assets further diminishes the value of the country and the country’s Statement of Position.
The problem is we have an economically illiterate population and a media who do not understand fifth form economics or business.
Companies are valued on their Net Asset Values, their Income Producing Abilities and their Future Cash Flow Generating Ability. The sale of these State Assets by the Crown further weakens this country, the increase of GST by 20% should have corrected some of the imbalances in the Country’s books, but the National Government granted tax cuts to the wealthy and increased borrowings from overseas to fund the tax cuts. Looks like they are trying to copy the Greek Situation.
Look at the state of the World Financial System and leading World Economies designed by leading economists and merchant bankers, look at the wealth transfers taking place, debt leads to further transfers of wealth from the Have Not’s to the Have’s that are controlling the world and the world’s banking system. The banks and the world’s Governments are all interlinked and John Key with his side kick Bill English are merely pawns in the game sucking up to the Big Brothers and the US Merchant Bankers.
Wasn’t John Key head hunted from Merrill Lynch by the BRT and the National Government specifically to come back to New Zealand to finish off the Asset Sales Programme that Roger Douglas (ACT) embarked on in the 1980′s.
Tim_G – during the election campaign in Dunedin North I often spoke of the United Future position on asset sales – supporting National’s right to part sell the specified power companies and Air NZ, but to not allow more than 49% private ownership (we notably held National to that this week), and to not sell Kiwibank, Radio NZ or water resources.
It should have been obvious to anyone that the water resources referred to were separate from hydro power stations.
As I recall David Clark never raised any question about it through the campaign.
Wannabe United future mp = Aspirational fail
The argument against these specific asset sales has long been won.
Defending, supporting and attempting to justify a very bad policy does you no credit at all.
Anyway, before the 2011 poll, I’m sure corporal jones said on Backbenches that uf wouldn’t vote with the government.
What changed? Baubels and big bmws.
Dunne’s treachery won’t be easily forgotten. At least, despite all his nothingness, he’s finally earning a political legacy
al1ens: repeating misinformation doesn’t change the facts. Dunne has been true to his word – repeated lies about the UF position have been proven wrong.
No change in UF position.
When I think of Peter Dunne I am reminded of a quote by David Lloyd George, British Prime Minister.
“He has sat on the fence so long that the iron has entered his soul.”
al1ens is right about Peter Dunne and United Future being over-represented in “nothingness”. What exactly does United Future stand for? I remember their last election campaign television advertisement being about hiking or some nonsense.
The sooner that Peter Dunne loses his electoral seat and ceases to be the political oddity that he is today the happier this voter will be.
Pete George – I dare say that you have hitched your wagon to the wrong star. In fact it’s not a star it’s just a silly hairdo.
Surely, with as much respect as I can muster, seeing Dunne on Backbenches saying he wouldn’t support the government position isn’t repeating misinformation.
I’m sure a tv archivist could find it to confirm or prove wrong my recollection, at which point I’ll concede the point. But until then, I’m quite ok with voicing my opinions on the mans integrity and position. Afterall, you take the shilling, you take the scrutiny and accountability with it.
“it’s not a star it’s just a silly hairdo.”
The plank effect.
The shame of it is that this is an issue that will affect the whole country adversely for generations if asset sales are carried out against the wishes of a large majority of new zealanders….
And all we get as defense of this intergenerational theft is an acolyte of what amounts to the “me me me, look at me” party attempting to convince himself publicly that he is really, really important, and influential….
It’s not only irritating to have to wade through material that sigmund freud would have relished analysing, but it is also a very blatant attempt to distract people from seeing the reality…
The reality is that united future have completely sold out….their “hair god” is indulging in utterly dishonest semantics attempting to absolve himself of any responsibility(in his own mind at least)…. his acolytes are no more than a group of very damaged individuals who would be better off spending time in psychotherapy rather than clogging up comments columns with their fantasies , and insecurities….
Once and for all people….United future have SOLD US OUT!!
No amount of bluster is going to hide that fact for long….
As I write this, I am contemplating having to move to australia simply to keep in contact with my own children….
How much more self serving drivel are we going to have to listen to while the exodus continues, and escalates?
Will the “bad hair” god only be happy when there isn’t anyone left to argue with him? Will he then be able to finally convince himself that he had no part in the loss of the best part of a generation of new zealanders?
When all said and done… does any member of united future actually give a tinkers damn about the effects on the health of nz society any more than the national party they have become so intrinsically wedded to?
One could be forgiven for assuming the worst, on the evidence so far…..
I’m a member of UnitedFuture and I’m more concerned with the increasing prevalence of the “wealth is bad, poor is morally superior”, tall poppy syndrome.
This is socialism which is a wealth destroyer. If we cultivated financial literacy and had policies encouraging investment then New Zealanders would benefit from the revenue stream into retirement and we’d all be better off for it.
After some of the nasy, bigoted stuff you’ve posted on your blog, your view on socialism and wealth destruction means absolutely nothing to me, nor I suggest, to many others on red alert.
For this reason, I dismiss you as an irrelevance with far too much time on her hands.
Booked your berth on the last chopper out of dodge yet?
al1ens – seriously, how relevant do you think your views are here in comparison to Monique’s? You (like bbfloyd) keep making boilerplate accusations that aren’t backed by facts, they’re contrary to the facts. It just sounds like you are a part of or being used by a dishonest smear machine.
“al1ens – seriously, how relevant do you think your views are here in comparison to Monique’s?”
Relevant is of course totally relative, but until told otherwise, by the proper mps on here, that is the one’s that actually made it into parliament, then I’ll take my chances and risk it like everybody else and be judged accordingly.
For example, I can admit to never having smeared the salvation army and the good work they do to feed some of the beaten victims of NZ poverty, badly let down by their peers and their government.
For that reason I dismiss Ms Watson.
Finding out she’s one of you uf oh types just backs up my perception from the get go.
Fact is, before the election, Dunne said he wouldn’t support the sale of the assets.
Wordplay around the meaning of water supply is nothing but political eunuchoidism, and for that reason, you’re dismissed too.
@Monique
Couldn`t agree more that we should cultivate financial literacy and have policies that encourage investment, BUT that should never involve the state selling its ‘best and fairest’ assets! THAT just encourages a transfer of wealth, and not in an equitable manner. Very rarely are state assets sold for their proper value. Selling 49% over a short period overwhelms a small market – and in a recession! – just crazy!!! But a seeming bargain for those wealthy enough to buy. Monique, that is not education – it is exploitation of the great bulk of NZer`s,
So presumeably you believe that asset sales will make us all better off. Pray , tell how!
Of course even those who buy our essential infrastructure may find that while the gov`t retains 51%, that their investment may not be the bonanza expected. Remember the slim electoral majority of the present government(including your chameleon – he of course present only because Key ‘cheated’ (I think so – by encouraging Nat faithful to slip a few Dunne votes)). It is very likely that Labour will control the majority of the assets next term and will act in the Nation`s interest(not the opportunist buyers) and returns will not be at all spectacular.
Myself, being a conspiracy theorist with respect of Key, Joyce and co(surely we have to be?), suspect that legal disputes by shareholders will be intense once the sales are complete. The absolute incompatability of a state controlling a company in the whole nations interest, and private shareholders who reasonably expect the company to maximise their profit, can only result in the stock exchange challenging the absurd marriage. The conspiracy I suspect is that ‘reluctantly(?)’ a National gov`t will soon move to hock off more than 50%.
This will result in a windfall for the private shareholders as the market will perceive that the sky is the limit for mainly pristine ‘green’ energy stocks, controlled by the market. Is this Key and co`s real plan?
But if the public can scupper that devious plan by returning a Labour led govenment(which should legislate to prevent legal challenge – good public policy), then the shares will not be a quick road to wealth. Should labour advise NOW that it will unquestionably work in the interests of all NZ, rather than that of the few opportunists, then sales may be so sluggish as to prevent the outrage from ever getting off the ground!?
Prospective shareholders forwarned cannot cry foul?
The really sobering thought is that a failing National/ Dunne/ Banks government will hock off more than 50% EVEN BEFORE the election.. They are capable of such duplicity?
In such a case the drastic ‘Winston option’ (nationalisation?), is all we have to retain control of some of the best energy infrastructure on the planet.
We must encourage an overwhelming ‘NO SALE’ vote in the referendum!
Bring back Winston nationalise State Assets including the BNZ that will stick it up Key and his nemisis Michelle Boag from the Winebox Enquiry which was a sham to protect interests involved.
Why is it unaffordable to buy back assets at the price they are sold at?
Given National have promised to set aside the money for future spending, it will be sitting there in 2014 waiting to be used to buy them back.
@little pete… thanks go to you, and moneyk for confirming every statement i’ve been forced to make regarding that excuse for a political party….
You can’t even come up with relevant insults….. if this is the quality of person in a position to assist the selling off of our childrens birthright, then we surely have reached the critical point regarding the continuing, and accelerating loss of our best, and brightest….
One really does begin to wonder if “bad hair” pete is any more capable of realistic, and pertinent analysis than his poodles.. At present, all that can be assumed is that united future has abandoned any pretence at principal in order to focus on wielding what power it has left to ensure a lucrative career after politics….
These are the jackals holding our country to ransom people!!!
Ask yourselves…. How stupid are we that we would let this type of self serving hack have so much influence?…. And my word, havn’t they made us pay for the dunneys future ambassadorship.
@SPC…. That’s a very charming sort of naivete your bringing to this column….. It seems almost a shame to have to point out to you that the asset strippers party have already spent the money three times over….
Does it not compute that when blinky bill brags in parliament that if the sale doesn’t go ahead, then the next govt will have to borrow billions more to cover the profligate generosity of the assetstripping party to it’s sponsors? Or is listening not a strength?
Let’s see…. version one… pays for “neutral” tax cuts… then when that didn’t satisfy the whiners who begrudge our uber wealthy their xmas bonus, paying for “new” infrastructure…..then we get version three, which is where the money will be used to “invest” in education, among other deserving causes…
Can’t recall blinky ever mentioning that he planned to hang on to the money for no other reason than he wanted to…
Or are we being provided some inside info here? does blinky and johnny “sparkles” fully intend to buy the assets back as long as we vote for them again? Is this going to be what they campaign on at the next election? fascinating….
National has said that the money will be used to fund future spending.
4 years of debt build up to cover deficits is a separate matter and not directly related to this.
Their future spending will be funded by the asset sales or by borrowing.
Labour said it would borrow to fund future (infrastructure) spending and keep the assets as they returned more than public debt cost.
It appears they are not standing by their words.
The only real problem is a buy back at higher than the sale price as this cannot be quantified and could raise the question of the economics of it – but a buy back at sale price can be quantified. The real question is why Labour will not support a buy back at sale price.
The principled position is to stand by the opposition to asset sales and those who sign the petition, and that requires signalling before any shares are sold that there would be a sale price buy back. Failure to do this could encourage National to sell cheap – and use the rising share price to deter any buy back.
Don’t worry in 20 years time we will have a Chinese Prime Minister and we will all be working as tenant farmers for the Chinese and the wealthy New Zealanders who have stripped the strategic assets and resources for their benefit.
Debt is an instrument used to transfer wealth, just look what the West has done in Third World Countries, lending money for consumption while they strip the resources.
In New Zealand over the past 30-40 years we have been consuming ourselves.
Our forebears who built this country actually did something like building railways, hydroelectric and geothermal power stations and a successful agricultural industry.
The Railway to Helensville in Auckland was built in 10 years, today we can’t even get it through the planning stages in a 10 year time frame.
Polly’s these days are like Movie Stars with an adoring press who wouldn’t understand how a balance sheet or a business actually worked. Since Muldoon robbed the country’s Pension Fund we have had successive Government feeding off State Assets through privatisation of these assets which are already owned by the people of New Zealand.
Debt and Merchant Banking are the reason the world is in a mess at present, what is wrong with holding onto good income producing assets which are currently owned by the people of New Zealand, once the Chinese or Multinational Corporates get hold of these assets, we will be at the mercy of their whims. With hydro electricity generation we also lose control of our water supplies.
Borrowing funds offshore to fund tax cuts to the wealthy is not a fair and equitable arrangement. Selling state assets is treasonous, however this country has a history of people selling assets which they do not actually own, maybe it is in the genetic bloodlines of certain groups of people here in New Zealand who see it as their right to rule and dispense with taxpayers assets to fund their own agendas and pet projects. This is the ideology of a Banana Republic.
Touching level of naivete you display there spc..(Same name as the canned peaches, no relation?)…
Well done on introducing, yet another version of what is planned for the money….even if it is one you dreamed up yourself…And not a hint of any awareness of how ridiculous the lengths you are prepared to go to simply to protect the fantasy that passes for reality around kitchen tables in tory heaven…
what was rather tiring is this insane assumption, held on to by most tory shills, is that, somehow, the labour party can enact their policies from the opposition benches…i suppose this is why the assetstrippers/act/uf govt can still keep blaming labour for every act of rank stupidity they perform…
Labour is secretly still the government….sneaky aye?
Apart from that, I did have a good belly laugh at the rather misguided attempts to argue intelligently (in their own minds) by the usual cast of Barnam & bailey rejects.
If i get bored with the usual nonsensical drivel served up, then i might go down to my local supermarket and consult some of those spc sliced peaches to see if they have any updates on “tory thinking”(yes, i know, it’s an oxymoron)…
“Labour is secretly still the government….sneaky aye?”
And key is a double agent bringing them down from the inside.
He’ll get a medal come the revolution
Monique Watson
What stuff have you been reading. Amazing conclusions.
Do you believe in trickle down also.
bbfloyd, so expecting Labour to act on its opposition to asset sales and actually prevent people profiting from buying up state assets is of some Tory agenda? Really?
What’s wrong, scared of people realising that Labour has no intention of stopping the asset sales but is just trying to make National pay a political price in 2014 to get re-elected?
Or you want to make an untaxed CG on the shares yourself?
Given the attempt to mock anyone getting in the way of people making political profit from, or personal profit from, the sale going ahead without any revision – what is it?
Thank God for the Money Tree which is named State Assets.
Cherries ripe for the picking, easy money.
National must be thanking their lucky stars for having the support of Cupcake and the Peacock.