In France and Greece consumers have a legal right to internet access. In Spain, Finland and Estonia it has been (or is being) enshrined as a human right. Earlier this year, the BBC commissioned a survey of more than 27,000 people in 26 countries that found that 79% of adults regard online access as a fundamental right.
This time the Sydney Morning Herald reports discussion initiated by Cyberspace Law and Policy Centre executive director David Vaile, backed by the former head of GetUp! Brett Solomon, who is now executive director of AccessNow.org in the US.
Red Alert ran a bit of a discussion on this issue last year. It is particularly relevant given the government’s intention to include a suspension of internet access clause into the new Copyright Bill about to come before the Commerce Select Committee. Labour supports the Bill (mostly) but opposes suspension.
I am interested to hear the Australian Human Rights Commission president Catherine Branson QC’s comments that:
while the Commission had not yet looked at internet access as a human right; it did recognise internet access may raise issues “relevant to the right to freedom of expression” as defined in a United Nation’s covenant on civil and political rights.
Hmm I’m not sure if it’s a right in and of itself, or more something that you have to have if a whole lot of your basic rights are to be upheld.
Either way, we should make sure everyone has it.
I can’t wait until F.F. posts his rationale of how the internet, along with access to adequate food, water, and shelter should not be considered any kind of right that a human being can lay claim to.
I don’t think it’s a right…
My personal opinion is that it is a service that you can have if:
- You can pay for it
- You don’t break any laws
The public can make it a right to have free access. Many interests would like to have some control over it and given time a greater measure of control will develop unless that is put off limits.
Already exploitation of the internet by multinationals such as google is rampant including using data about you for their profit.
Control is being gained and the public need to act in establishing rights.
Were telephones a human right?
I guess it shows how lucky we are that we can even consider it a human right, when most of the planet struggles to uphold the pesky human rights of food shelter and security.
@JohnW agreed
@Tracey – Yeah, it would be nice to eliminate poverty
A good step towards universal internet access is getting the price of broadband down.
Were telephones a human right?
Zactly. Wish Clare would stop pushing this, really. If my mate doesn’t have the internet in France, are his rights being violated? Will Amnesty International answer the call?
Internet access – a Human right?
All I can say is that the priorities of some people shock me.
Laughable, yet sinister at the same time.
There was no internet when I was a child. Were my human rights violated?
May be that i’m just not ‘getting it’.
I think phones have become a need of some sort. (111 calls etc, safety issues) I do not think it will be long be before internet is considered the same way.
Already college children are at a disadvantage if they do not have access to the net, yet there are lots of families that cannot afford access. Where does it leave them? I know it not a ‘need’ as defined as survival relies on it, but it is becoming more and more important.
That is how I see it anyway.
Internet is becoming more and more important. Access to so much information and becoming increasingly a natural way for people to communicate. Students are becoming more and more reliant on it. I cannot imagine not being able to study at a uni level without access to the internet, not just because I’m doing it from home and need access to down load lectures (which is hard with dial up) but even if you are going to lectures at the Uni, I think that you would need access to study.
You are at a disadvantage if you do not have access. It becomes the haves and the have nots. The educated and the disadvantaged and uninformed. Even if it is just self education, keeping up to date on certain important topics. You are at a disadvantage in society if you cannot access the internet.
If this is what it is like now, what will it be like in 10-15yrs time? The people that do not have access now, how worse off will they be?
I suppose it is because I don’t take for granted anything I have, that I appreciate the fact that I have access and the importance of it. I know how lucky I am compared to so many people that are in the same position as me. They don’t really have a clue what is going on, and unable to access to information to find out. Even job searching etc is hard without access.
Yes there is always the public library and internet cafes in towns, but if you live rurally without access at home, I feel you could be at a real disadvantage. Even people at home with children. You cannot just pack them up and head down to one of these places to use the net. It would be madness. I know I have tried when I had to send an important email. Never again.
I dunno, there is so much crap on the Internet masquerading as fact and research, I fight a constant battle with my students who think an opinion piece is a valid source for an academic essay.
I’m pretty sure we all survived before cell phones. I dont want to sound like a luddite, I’m not. But a human right?
Kings College students had laptops and PC to each child long before other school children, and some schools still dont. Disparities will always exist.
I wish I could believe this broadband roll out was REALLY about our schools.
Loota, on what basis, you think that you have a right to get access to the internet on someone else’s property? There is no one stropping you mate from getting access to the internet, just set up your own service. If I have my own service (i.e., my own property), you don’t have a right to what is mine. If I refuse to allow you to subscribe to my internet services, your rights are not being violated one single iota.
Stop being fixated on bogus rights.
How about you go to Tonga, Samoa, Fiji and other 3rd world & underdeveloped countries and give them a Santa Claus internet services. WHY? The majority of the populations in those countries don’t have access to internet. Have their human rights being violated? Nope! None at all. Do their respective governments violate their citizens human rights for not proving everyone internet access, even though those government can’t afford to do so? Nope! Those governments have done nothing wrong. Hang on, but who’s been violating those countries’ citizens, since they can’t get access to the internet. No one. In fact, their rights have not being violated at all. Getting access to internet is a privilege and not a right.
Try to reason from bottom up rather than top down. Start from property rights.
C’mon Loota, the people of Ha’apai & Vava’u Isles in Tonga are waiting from socialist Santa Claus like you to go there and set up internet services for them to use. Perhaps you may get some profits in Tongan Pa’anga for doing so. I guess that you would be motivated to do that, since you might be feeling sympathize with the residents in Ha’apai & Vava’u because their human rights are being violated for not getting access to the internet.
PS: When you’re ready to go and set up your internet business there in those isle group in Tonga, then please alert me, so I can hook you up with some local contacts there.
…for not proving everyone
meant to be:
… for not providing everyone
@Falafulu Fisi
Your analogies of Samoa Tonga etc are about as useful as the arguments about Somalia that you rally against.
Its simple; to participate in a ever digitizing society that New Zealand is, its citizen need access to the internet. The old adage of information is power is true; and to withhold or deny access to information is use of force.
Your libertarian philosophy doesn’t hold water in any arguments about access; as it does not recognise concept of power and force beyond your narrow view.
I certainly agree it would be great for everyone to have the access Richard, but elevating it to a human right?
There’s a fundamental flaw in defining Internet access as a human right in New Zealand – that is that one company controls those International lines. If we’re to have internet as an essential piece of communication, then we’re at the whims of this one company – and that company doesn’t appear to have any real concern for it’s customers.
@Nevyn.
Yes just like phones which are increasingly vital to the point where some form of phone access can be argued as a necessity, be it a mobile or landline.
@Tracy
Yes I agree. There does need to have some education around what is opinion and what is valid research. I have shown on previous threads though (by pulling up past cases of privacy breeches) that internet is an important tool to find out and research topics to stay informed. I think I have shown that anyway. Also maybe not mobile phones but at least a landline. If something happened to one of my children and I couldn’t dial 111, or the other month when I had an intruder in the middle of the night (or 1.30am) if I couldn’t call the police I would have been lost.
These are just my thoughts on the topic though.
@ Nevyn
I’m not sure that is a flaw; but a reason to debate and thrash out some solutions and set a standard for access.
The BBC (News Site) has been under fire from the Murdoch Media Empire as the State funded organisation is so good at what they do his companies can’t compete. Britain has always supported a State funded independent media organisation as a key component of democracy.
Italy is a prime example of what happens when media power is concentrated in private hands. Force is used against the citizens by denying information. Prodi has sacked and used his personal and organisational power against critics in the media who disagree with him. The masses never hear the criticisms or hear of the critics again; because he controls the mass media.
A Mother – I dont disagree that it is important and desirable that people, as many as possible, have INternet access, I just am not convinced by anything yet that it is elevated to a human right. Heck as a nation and global community we already suck at guaranteeing everyone in our sphere food shelter and security.
Of course you would have come to harm, no one argues against that. What did people do before they had a cellphone or telehphone line? I guess the other part of my argument is, is it a human right to have a cellphone?
Richards said…
to participate in a ever digitizing society that New Zealand is, its citizen need access to the internet.
You’re restating the point that I made above. Who is stopping you from getting access to the internet? You can’t force via law a private enterprise to give access to anyone base that he/she’s got human rights.
I am not arguing on getting access to the internet if people want to that. No one is holding a gun to their heads. I am against forcing private owners to simply give anyone internet access using their services, because the law say so.
I believe that there are some super-markets/shopping-malls that ban people (mainly young) wearing hoodies from entering their premises based on their own sets of criteria. May be those hoodies, intimidate shoppers or perhaps they’re the ones that have been identified doing shoplifting the most. The owners are within their (property) rights to refuse entry to anyone they don’t like such as hoodies. Tell me if you would argue otherwise that hoodies’ rights are being violated? I would love hear your view on that.
Do the hoodies have any rights violated? None at all.
Your analogy to Somalia is way off, which bears no similarity to my point about people in the islands having no access to the internet.
Let me be clear. I am not against people getting access to the internet via subscribing to some internet services out there or simply setup their own services. What I am against, is that this bogus internet human rights becoming a law. You know what does that mean. The rights of the owners (the real legitimate rights) are simply being taken away and handed over to non-owners and this is a violation of fundamental rights (i.e., property).
I hope that you understand of where I am arguing here.
@sean14.
There was no internet around when I was younger either, doesn’t mean it not important now. Remember watching a news segment saying in 5-10 years that we would be reading the paper on line, thought it was a funny that it would happen and a bit far fetched. It may have taken longer than 5-10 years but here we are though and I cannot deny the importance of the internet and the impact it has made and is having on my life.
We only had commodore 64’s and we didn’t have one of those either, my grandad had one at his house us grandkids went around and used after school.
@Tracey
Your right; Human Right might be a bit strong, how about a right of the Citizens of this country. Our Bill of Rights is not a superior law (it should be) and I’m not suggesting internet access should be added to it.It could be set as a standard or measurement of success in the area of free speech perhaps.
Tracy
You are right about surviving before the internet and telephones for that matter. Similarly with motorcars, washing machines and electricity.
The internet was a development by individuals not governments or corporations.
As it now exists then openness to all is paramount.
Just as the internet can be used for good with sharing of knowledge it also can be used for sinister purposes. Propaganda is abound as is misinformation and sometimes this is planned and a part of a controlling strategy.
Yes you do have to be able to sort the misinformation from the reliable reporting but whats new.
Most of the media in NZ is controlled by a small multinational group who just never report a range of important international events. Even worse we are fed myths and lies over and over until you hear then being repeated as though they were axiomatic.
The internet allows us to take in a much wider perspective and expose much of the mindwash we are fed.
Because the internet is there we must have access or greater inequity will be unchallenged.
No he ran off when I woke, luckily, as I’m the size and weight of an average 12yr old and he was 6 foot. No immediate danger as he ran off, but didn’t at the time know if anyone else was in house or not. Maybe not mobiles but def a landline at least.
Before everyone had a landline or mobile? Hmmm. Maybe things were safer? I don’t know, I wasn’t around.
It could be argued that most in NZ have access via libraries and internet cafes but think NZers have a right to some way of access to information via the net.
Rurally it would be harder, and as far as I’m aware access isn’t to all towns in NZ? It should be I believe be a right of these communities to be able to access the internet. I do see it as a fundamental right for them to be able to have access.
This is interesting.
What do you consider to be ‘human rights’?
Perhaps a list?
Sorry if it seems unrelated to the thread, but I don’t believe it is unrelated.
I’m glad you were fine A Mother
I kinda agree with you that internet is a necessity important for social contact and for work.
I consider Human rights primarily to be as outlined by the United Nations original convention/s.
NZers do have access via libraries.
I know that when I have had times in my life away from news and internet(sometimes for months) my quality of life hasnt suffered in the least. I am NOT saying the internet and email is not a useful tool, but I can also see how it stresses people’s lives, makes everything instantaneous and peoples expectations are that everything is attended to NOW.
Still unconvinced that it’s a human right.
A Mother some people say we were safer, but I can assure you the 80’s was still a media roll call of violence and murders…
If the lines are not there to enable citizens to connection if they wished or even libraries in these towns to connect to the internet, then I do see it as wrong and a violation of some sort of a rights issue.
Of course these people may not be able to stand up and argue their point as they don’t have access and we are having this discussion on line.
How fair is that?
They’re not losing hours a day with being sidetracked either mother
http://www.ohchr.org/en/issues/Pages/WhatareHumanRights.aspx
A kind of list
Yes the 80’s.
Was thinking more of the 70’s (I was born in 79) or the 60’s. Everyone I knew in the 80’s still had a landline. I didn’t own a mobile until I was in my 20’s. I don’t see that as a right as such.
Though even then using the example above, if people want to have a cell phone and access in communities are not there, should this be seen as a right? I’m not sure. Haven’t thought about it in depth.
I think there are two separate components with regard to ‘rights’.
First, access to the internet – i.e. how you connect.
Second, freedom of the internet – i.e. keeping it free of censorship.
The first is an economic exercise – if you want it you pay for it, just like phones and television. I am comfortable with paying my share to ensure those in need get food and shelter, but TV and internet? Line – crossed.
The second I would support being included as human rights. Freedom of information without government censorship (ok, kiddie porn bad, hunt and prosecute – along with using any communication medium in the commission of a crime).
A Mother is right, internet alleviates social isolation and gives opportunities, no internet access no participation!
http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/index.shtml
Am trying to find the original declaration (it’s been altered alot over the years), but this seems to be it
http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/index.shtml
Having read these I can see how Internet could fit a few categories.
P.S – to A Mother: “If the lines are not there to enable citizens to connection if they wished or even libraries in these towns to connect to the internet, then I do see it as wrong and a violation of some sort of a rights issue. ”
Satellite provides service to those areas now. Issue solved?
http://www.ipstar.co.nz/en/index.html
Even though a mobile would ensure everyone could call for help, speaks to security, yet the INternet wont make anyone safe.
Spud I accept the internet is USED for those things and IF humans had no other means of interacting with each other, things like talking, meeting, writing letters etc I would agree it might become a Human Right.
It also creates social isolation and takes away opportunities, for personal growth, for community activity, exercise, etc etc
Thank you for the link, Tracey.
Sorry to be going on, but we (NZ) cannot even guarantee this (below) yet we want to focus on INternet as a HUman Right?
” basic human rights that children everywhere have: the right to survival; to develop to the fullest; to protection from harmful influences, abuse and exploitation; and to participate fully in family, cultural and social life. “
That is true, not being sidetracked. I should be preparing chicken nuggets and crumbing the chicken peices I got on special in crushed cornflakes (makes them crunchy.) This is the only day I get free during the week so I’m taking time out for myself today.
You wouldn’t be able to easily access that list without the internet. Maybe argued as a fundamental right as a collective?
Maybe I’m wrong. I can just state how I see it.
Not as easily but you know I read it years ago, before the Internet. I used a library.
I dont think you’re wrong, you and I just have a different opinion on this topic. I’m not sure either of us is capable of being right or wrong, just opinion.
Yea okay you got me there.
Should be made affordable then.
@Tracey 1.41 – Yes there are other avenues but the internet is immediate and isn’t charged by the minute. You get real time interactions with a lot of people simultaneously, and shift workers can come in at 3am and have an online chat without calling and waking somebody up!
Plus, invalids are able to meet people, being sick must make it harder to make friends.
- I do agree with you about the pitfalls, internet addiction is a b****!
I know, I was horribly addicted last year 
Am fine now 
It can shorten life spans and stuff too 
“participate fully in family, cultural and social life” Which now extends to the internet 500 million people are on FB. Many people have relatives in other countries.
Yes. It is fun debating though. It keeps my mind active and a chance to interact with other adults.
Could be argued that it is becoming increasingly important for education in NZ society and education is a fundamental right.
If you believe then that Broadband access is a fundamental human right, would you be prepared to volunteer some of your cash to pay for it for all to use?