There’s been a bit of talk about rape and pillage recently.
Our Maori Party parliamentary colleague says it’s been our land, foreshore and seabed that have been raped and pillaged.
I see community leader and Black Power life member Dennis O’Reilly believes the real battle today is the fight against the drug P.
Others will say that something else is the issue for Maori. None will be wrong.
The fact is bad stuff has happened to Maori over the last couple of hundred years which has led to Maori being at the bottom of the heap. We are generally dumber, sicker, poorer, more pissed, drugged and pregnant than any other group of people in New Zealand. We know the problem, but what’s the solution?
Well let’s repeal the Foreshore and Seabed and put the F&S into Maori title. We can be dumber, sicker, poorer, more pissed, drugged and pregnant at the beach. That’ll make all the difference. At least we’ll be dumber, sicker, poorer, more pissed, drugged and pregnant on our own turf and surf.
Let’s get rid of P. That crap is a scourge and along with alcohol, cigarettes and marijuana is killing our people. But it’s still only a symptom of what the real issues are.
The real issue for Maori is ourselves.
We generally live with this big chip on our shoulders.
I’m Maori, so I have every right to be a victim. Personally, I can’t be bothered.
We can accuse all and sundry of raping and pillaging our land, foreshore ad seabed – but we as Maori have done a helluva a lot to ourselves too. We would do well to hold a mirror up to our own faces, but it’s a helluva lot easier to blame those bloody pakehas.
We have a really simple solution to all our woes. It goes like this – every Maori child born from the start of this new decade (and earlier) be loved, fed and educated so that he or she may go on to become a successful leader, and become extremely wealthy and/ or influential. Then when he or she see an injustice against our people, use that wealth and influence to correct the situation.
That’s what pakeha do. We could learn from them.
Didn’t Sir Apirana Ngata say something along these lines a few years back? If we’d listened then we wouldn’t be in this mess.
By 2040, the 200th year after the signing of The Treaty of Waitangi we could have thousands of wealthy and influential 30 year old Maoris. Imagine that – a generation of Maori capable of leading the world.
By all means keep up the fight to correct injustices – but can we honestly say we’ve put an equal effort into sorting our own crap out?
Feeding, loving and educating our kids is a good start.
Our apprenticeships into the world of wealth and influence need not be by way of drugs, violence, alcohol and court appearances.
Of course we could carry on like we are – and be even dumber, sicker, poorer, more pissed, drugged and pregnant,.
But at least we’ll have our Foreshore and Seabed.
nice to read kelvin, I think you need to speak up more often against chest beaters who want to scratch the itch of prejudice. it is much easier to scratch the itch than deal with issues and your right we need to deal with issues
To be honest, I believe personally:
1) Things like the foreshore and seabed should be there for every one
2) every one should be treated equally, and not thrown to the “bottom of the heap”.
I personally dont know enough about the issue to say whose name it should be in, but if the 2 criteria above are met, I think that everyone wins.
I hear what you are saying Kelvin
But just for the record I don’t agree that Maori are dumber
“dumber, sicker, poorer, more pissed, drugged and pregnant,.”
Perhaps the rest but never the first
i think he means not as well educated, not less intelligent raymon
Good post Kelvin, although I imagine the real answer about why Maori “under-perform” is probably a complex interaction between current, historic, internal and external factors. Breaking poverty cycles is unfortunately not as easy as saying “hey, let’s get out of this cycle” (although you could also argue that breaking the cycle is impossible if you don’t do that).
So just as the problem is a complex combination of factors, so will be the solution I imagine. And probably the most effective way to do something to raise Maori achievement is not a single “big bang” approach, but rather hundreds (or thousands) of slightly different approaches, tailored to the individuals and the situations. But, as you say, unless Maori also want to be part of the solution then all the efforts in the world will simply be like pissing into the wind.
But hey, at least we’re WAY better than Australia in this regards.
Raymon – I would hazard a guess that Kelvin is referring to what bourgeouis pakeha would probably call something like “a lower level of educational outcomes”.
The problem I have about the comment that Maori are “dumber, sicker, poorer, more pissed, drugged and pregnant”, is that it is untrue and racist if someone of non Maori denomination says it, but is correct and a fair comment if a Maori person says it.
Go figure?!?!
I normally disagree with almost everything on this blog
But that was a brilliant post and to be honest:
” It goes like this – every Maori child born from the start of this new decade (and earlier) be loved, fed and educated so that he or she may go on to become a successful leader, and become extremely wealthy and/ or influential”
as a Pakeha that is a world I would love to live in as well. We live in hope that one day that becomes reality.
good post but I’m not sure any of us need to be “extremely wealthy”, just that wealth needs to be spread more evenly.Having a few Maori “get on” won’t help most Maori just as the fact that there are rich Pakeha doesn’t help poor ones.
I think the Foreshore and Seabed was discriminatory and does need a fix. My personal favour of a fix is to confiscate the 1/5th of the foreshore and seabed still in private ownership and compensate all involved (Maori for their customary rights) so that we can have better access to our beaches. Where there are common customary rights Maori have over the beach make them legal to all Maori without having this process of going through lengthy court process to prove continuous practice since 1840 and then maybe everyone can be a bit happier.
However you are right. That act means nothing to the majority of Maori. Even if it were never passed it is unlikely any Maori would have received full title to the land. Customary rights would probably have been extended to only a few Iwi since the common law levels are still quite high to prove their have a right to it. Compared to the massive social and economic issues Maori people face it is nothing. I agree they need to take more personal responsibility as you say but the state could also be doing a lot more to reduce these problems in our society. I am also not really sure these issues are anything to do with race or have been for the last 100 years. Maori started off in the system at the bottom and there is usually only around 5% social mobility in western societies. They would have needed to far exceed Pakeha efforts to maintain equality in these issues with them. All people in lower socio-economic conditions face these problems and they need to be dealt with.
I think feeding, loving and educating children is spot on. But do you really want to take on greedy pakeha aspirations of wealth and influence as well? If you do, nothing will change – you’ll still have (and I’ll assume a figurative meaning of) dumber, sicker, poorer, more pissed, drugged and pregnant people – it’ll just mean a slightly different group of wealthy and influential doing the damage. It’ll be business as usual, but with more Maori adopting failed pakeha thinking to continue to hurt Maori.
Just a couple of responses:
1) @Raymon dumber = less educated
2) @Dorothy we shouldn’t be aiming for a few Maori to “get on” – we should be aiming for all Maori to “get on”
3) @James – pakeha probably can’t get away with saying dumber, sicker, poorer etc, but is it wrong (generally) and does that mean it shouldn’t be said?
4) @everyone – what’s the best way to make us brainier, healthier, wealthier, sober-er, un-drugged-er and stopping our kids having kids? Repeal the Foreshore and Seabed? How long after it’s repealed will the feel good factor last, before reality sets in and we realise we’re just as dumb, sick, poor, drunk, drugged and hapu as we were before the repeal? What will our next excuse be? Because when that excuse is dealt to, there’ll be another.
Agree with Anton on this. I change in attitude is need from Maori however a means to progress is also needed.
Drug addicts need to be treated medically rather than criminally. I rich person sends their drug addicted child to a doctor. A poor persons drug addicted child only ever sees the inside of a cell.
Living standards of the poorest need to be raised closer to those at the top. Its no good saying send your children to the doctor and school every day when the quality of the services available to them will never put them on an even footing as someone of privilege.
As Jarbury points out the attitude to change from Maori is needed but in reality they also need the support of the state in thousands of little ways to assist in achieving these goals.
I agree with your post, Maori should be given the best chance of an early age so that they may succeed in life.
I also agree that resenting white people isn’t good for them.
Sounds like the consensus is that there should be one law for all and an objective of equal treatment. Now where have I heard that before !!!!
[...] Labour MP Kelvin Davis calls on Maori to put an equal effort into “sorting our own crap out”, as into fighting to correct past injustices. [...]
Kelvin, I don’t think anyone’s saying that repealing the Foreshore and Seabed Act will fix all the problems you’ve described, but this doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be repealed. The last Labour government, disappointingly, ran roughshod over the effects of a carefully set out judgment of the Court of Appeal, sending the message that when the courts do something for Maori the executive doesn’t like it’ll just legislate, in search of the populist vote. It’s the way this was done that’s distasteful – no discussion, end of story – and is reminiscent of what national in the 1990s did and what Labour was contantly complaining about. We all now should be making sure that repeal won’t be simply a repeat performance by national, with the Maori Party kidding themselves that their support has brought gains in other areas. The result must be something everyone can live with (what ever that might be). Of course, I have no faith that national will do right by Maori, and that their arrogance will bring yet more for Maori to feel legitimately aggrieved about. Importantly though, even if repeal is carried out properly and brings a respectful outcome for Maori, the socio-economic issues you raise are not going to disappear, but least foreshore and seabed issue won’t add to them.
This particular quote from your post is almost perfect.
“We have a really simple solution to all our woes. It goes like this – every Maori child born from the start of this new decade (and earlier) be loved, fed and educated so that he or she may go on to become a successful leader, and become extremely wealthy and/ or influential. Then when he or she see an injustice against our people, use that wealth and influence to correct the situation.”
If you would like to make it perfect, all you need to do is remove the word “Maori”. Every child deserves to be loved, fed and educated.
This is one Labour person I could vote for.
The F&S has not added to any socio-economic issues Anton. It’s just a side show. Many maori havn’t realised that if you’re not part of the solution you’re part of the problem. Too many are waiting for someone to come and help them but they need to help themselves…. However, there are some maori who have helped themselves and are now regular, intelligent, tax paying citizens. The F&S is just an irritating itch. It has little to do with any real problems that NZ is facing and it’s just a political points scorer. In my mind no part of this country belongs to just maori. New Zealand belongs to New Zealanders, that includes maori.
@Anton, the Foreshore and Seabed Act issue needs to be settled one way or another, so that we can get on and address the real issues that are inhibiting Maori from progressing. This blog isn’t really about the F&S, it is about trying to get Maori to realise there is another way forward that doesn’t mean we’re always bleating on about how mean those naughty pakeha have been to us. I do not deny what has gone on in our history and I really want all greviances addressed, but while all that’s going on, what’s happening to make us brighter, healthier, wealthier, more influential etc?
Sorry, we don’t have to sort our crap out because we can always say it’s the pakeha’s fault we’re in the state we’re in.
Education isn’t the only solution, but it is probably the best of the bunch.
@David W, as long as the one law for all benefits Maori interests as much as much as it has pakeha interests.
I applaud the stance you take on Maori standing up and starting the march towards level footing themselves. However it isn’t “another way forward” it is a part of the way forward. The F&S showed that there is still a feeling in government that some issues relating to Maori it is safer to step on their rights than to go against public opinion. Repealing it in a meaningful way goes a long way towards giving faith to Maori today that their rights are considered as important as any one elses. It helps no one to minimize that.
“We have a really simple solution to all our woes. ……………. Then when he or she see an injustice against our people, use that wealth and influence to correct the situation.
That’s what pakeha do. We could learn from them”.
Well no Kelvin they are not. That is what the Chinese are currently doing!
If Pakeha really did those things NZ would be at the top of tables not the bottom.
But credit for your honesty. Easily the most honest piece to come from a Labour Party politician in my memory.
Finally. Thank you.
F & S isn’t the point, this is about a) our priorities as Maori and b) finding ourselves new pathways forward. I’ve waited a long time for someone to say this stuff.
The F&S issue is a farce. There can be no customary right to the seabed as the Maori in 1840 weren’t using it. The foreshore is another matter but even then the amount that Maori can claim of it is going to be minor and the laws regarding taking of seafood etc are still going to apply (Not that those laws seem to be doing anything – my nephew went out the other day and spent 3 hours getting what, 3 years ago, took 20 minutes).
Exactly.
You heard it before at Nationals Orewa One. There was always a problem with it though – National don’t believe in it. They believe in no rules for them and their mates and everyone else to do as they’re told. That’s what you get from a bunch of dictators.
Rob – where is there difficulty in gaining access to our beaches where the F & S has enabled a decision leading to the awarding of cutomary title over a specified territory? And, how does amending the act to confiscate and compensate a 5th of f and s solve the issue of Maori economic, social, educational and health performance?
The issue about the Act simply has to be dealt with one way or another, some Maori are distracted as to the virtue and affect of repealing the legislation or not – just make a decision and do it.
The real issue here is about owning the past and getting on with it. Yes, there were actions that caused a lot of problems… but what are we, Maori, doing about it? This counters the debate that Maori are a singular, they are not and the Maori Party for one, has no mandate to negotiate my future on my behalf. Don’t just accept, take part, be accountable, achieve!!
The F and S is absolute distraction, just as the Maori Flag Hui series was, just as Tariana’s eventual failure to deliver on her promises to deal with the ill-effects of smoking for Maori.
Some Maori see the world as something against which to defend themselves by virtue of a shared history. Enough. Time has come for Maori to take responsibility for their own well being as a people and as individuals in as much as other parts of our communities have to.
Dorothy, you’re wrong sorry. The aspiration of wealth, alongside many other aspirational values, is worthy. None of that suggests letting go of culture or values, it does ask that we accept whatever it was we believe has happened and MOVE ON.
It is enough now, those who identify as Maori, must singuarly and collectively accept accountability for themselves – enough with the silly distractions.
Get on with it.
Good post, Kelvin.
@ Kaine T – it must have been liberating reading Kelvin’s post after knowing what the problem is all this time, yet idly waiting until someone else articulated it for you.
Lets not forget that the majority of New Zealanders of all ethnicities, a fair few Maori included, have had a guts full of the excuses and whinging.
If I had a public voice, I would have been heard on this same thing a long time ago. If you’re that interested http://grassroots.labour.org.nz/profiles/blogs/a-voice-foreshore
@ Anton Craig: I completely agree with your post.
I think that for a democracy to be healthy there needs to be a certain amount of tension between the Executive, the legislature and the judiciary. What Labour did showed that the judiciary has a noticeable lack of power and that there is no balancing tension between the three. I think this shows that the party in power (If it can operate effectively in power that is) has access to unfettered power through controlling the Executive and the judicial branches.
In this instance of the F&S this has lead to Maori being denied their customary rights as well as their right to due process.
I think P is bad. I just don’t know what it has to do with the F&S.
how does everyone miss the role social welfare plays?
Kia ora Kelvin, an enlightening post and not before time from your side of the fence. Unfortunately too many of todays young Maori take the easy road but unlike their European counterparts who suck of the parental tit, growing young Maori suck of any tit that they can bite onto. It is a problem that will not be solved instantly but there are some good people and organisations who work tirelessly to encourage and nurture those who seek to improve their own lot. Never heard of them? ha just like the millions of other kiwis that don`t make the headlines, the ones who line up at Presbyterian support, Catholic opshops, Salvation Army and many more like charities. So to you who belittle Maori as bludgers, drunks, thieves etc remember it is a minority that are in this situation just as a minority of other races are.
Wow, this is one of the best posts I’ve seen on here for a long time.
Well done Kelvin, I think that you’ve hit the nail on the head with this one.
It’s great to see an MP who actually lays his thoughts out there!
Every one seems to be againts the F and S, but here is my concern about repealing it.
If Maori are able to claim parts of the foreshre for private ownership, and then they can on sell it to private owners, we will loose a big part of kiwi culture with being able to go to any beach we want to. There does come a point when we have to look at overall kiwi culture and protect it. I know of parts of rivers that are claimed by maori and no one is allowed near it without permission. Is this what we want for all NZ rivers and beaches?
Yes, the F&S issue is of course very separate to socio-economic position of Maori – repeal, as I’ve said, will not and cannot provide the great fix we’re in desperate need of. But is it a farce? Tell that to the thousands that marched when Labour decided it disagreed with the CA? There’s confusion in this discussion between whether repeal will fix position of Maori, whether repeal is necessary, and whether no repeal will make things worse. Will it fix things? No, simple commonsense says the issues are far too complex for this. Is repeal necessary? Yes, the legislation was passed with arrogant disregard for the views of the particular group of NZers the CA judgment found in favour of, that group just happened to be Maori. The decision wasn’t because that group is Maori, it was because of the history of how our nation began as recognised by law. Ignoring that means no respect for the rule of law and that the legal rights of a particular group can be railroaded through. Will no repeal make things worse? Yes, it will add to the sense of injustice that Maori already feel, increasing the divide already present where rights of indigeneous are trampled on if they don’t suit the dominant partner, leading to even less respect followed by the tangible consequences being the general position of Maori overall. You say “just forget it and get on with things”. Where would we be if everyone said this? It’s this Alan Duff syndrome and similar attitudes that are causing the problems, not the legal rights of Maori.
Kaine I don’t think it would solve the social problems however there is an unfairness in it that should still be fixed. There is currently areas of beach that we still cannot access. The Foreshore and Seabed act was enacted in the fear that our beaches would not be accessible at all. I would like to see them as accessible as possible so I think the fix is to make it all public aside from ports.
I agree that it is being used as a distraction but it should still be fixed in some way.
The social issues Maori face can’t simply be fixed by personal responsibility however. The social gap at present is too great for it to be done in any reasonable period of time that way.
What an Excellent Post,Kelvin I agree with you 100%,i just wonder whether Labour is the party that is suitable for someone not afraid to stand up and speak out on a issue that is usualy considered “Taboo”.Although last year I have seen alot of positvie change in certain Labour Politicians Eg your Leader Phil Goff..i guess only time will tell whether this is the direction Labour is going and if so I personally would be happy. With the current Government heading down a dark and dingy road to Political Correctness it is refreshing and at the same utterly imperative that Labour as the main Opposition Party speaks out on these issues and stops any advance of Political Correctness that seems to be creeping in under Key’s Leadership.
Great topic, and good discussion. One thing that does get overlooked, most if not all Maori are now interbred with Pakeha. Whay can not people see themselves as Kiwis and move on. The Maori/Pakeha person can use the benefits of either part of their background surely? Maybe I am oversimplifying this, but I dont personally differentiate the skills, knowledge or abilities based on race whether they be Pakeha, Maori, Asian, whatever. I understand Maori wishing to retain their heritage, but… most of the rest, does not need to focus on race.
Kelvin, interesting piece here. I agree in a sense that attitude is a key part of success in life, and that social attitudes in some parts of the community (not only Maori communities) could probably change for the better.
On F&S, my biggest sadness is that the process we chose for dealing with the court case and pushing through the law was the wrong one. It was abrupt and not negotiated. If we had sat down and calmly talked through how to protect customary rights, access to the foreshore and so on, I think we’d have come to a very similar place legislatively, without all the political and personal damage that occurred to so many back in 2003-05 — and which continues to today.
Finally – as a Labour MP, you might well have ideas you haven’t talked about in this post about the class and ideological position of Maori and the post-colonial situation. Would you share them here? For what it’s worth, my view is that it is a collective challenge for the state and society to respond to the “bottom of the heap” situation of Maori and others who are in that position; individualising the problem or responsibility for it won’t lead to the changes we all want to see.
Jordan
I certainly don’t vote for Labour, but this guy at least is telling it like it is!
Hello Kelvin
Many progressive Pakeha are going to disagree with you – not that you necessarily exist to please them, of course.
First, they don’t admire their own culture’s dominant value base as much as you seem to! Some of them won’t like your seeming endorsement of philanthropy, and of having influence and solving problems on account of becoming wealthy first.
Second, they know what many other Pakeha want or understand ‘moving on’ or ‘looking forward’ to mean when it comes to race relations in New Zealand – and one of the tangles of your position is that you are talking for and about Maori, but mostly to Pakeha. Many Pakeha want to move on/run away from any thing that is Maori and challenging or controversial – be that thing a matter of the past, the present or the future – and want or understand ‘moving on’ and ‘looking forward’ to imply the demise or cancellation of any present and future economic and social policy directed at Maori concerns. This sentiment is a deep-seated response to the self-knowledge that Pakeha gained their economic foothold here by means of confiscation. The associated risk of that sentiment – and it will break through if Labour doesn’t stand up for anything – is of the end of any Labour/social democratic analysis, strategy and action directed at Maori concerns.
In my view you encourage that sentiment by arguing too strongly that Maori problems have their causes in the family rather than in a social system which needs to be changed by ideologically informed collective action. Self-help is not a family affair alone. The union movement and the Labour Party originated as working class self-help.