It’s no secret that Matt McCarten, Willie Jackson, John Tamihere and Hone Harawira are mates. A bunch of blokes who stick together and (like to) stick it up the establishment. I get that. They’ve made careers out of being unPC.
But there are times when the best thing you can do for a mate is to tell him (or her) when you’ve crossed the line and that you’ve got to suck it up.
Matt’s column in this morning’s Herald on Sunday is pretty transparently an apologist piece for Hone’s behaviour and an overt warning to the Maori Party.
Watch out Matt. You might have gone too far.
See the bit above and right. About. Clare I’m the last one to be described as a mate of Matt, John, Willie and/or Hone but I think Matt has his political analysis about correct in fact it is pretty similar to a post yesterday on Red Alert :- http://blog.labour.org.nz/index.php/2009/11/14/tariana-v-hone-who-will-the-real-party-back/
I agree with that article, storm in a teacup as far as I’m concerned…
Totally agree with the article.
Was the email racist? Was Don Brash using his Orewa speech to dog-whistle up redneck support racist? Was Helen Clark’s decision to drive through the Foreshore and Seabed legislation, to stop Maori taking land cases to court like everyone else, racist? Was MP John Carter phoning John Banks on his talkback show pretending to be a Maori dole-bludger racist?
There are far greater crimes of institutional racism in this country, perpetuated every day by Governments and media companies – which was Hone’s point.
Your salivating over this is pretty awful to watch.
Forget sniping at Hone, it’s Tariana causing the damage to the left.
Unless you know something I don’t, Clare, I would suggest that you’ve missed the real politik from this entire episode.
Let’s put aside that there isn’t a single thing in McCarten’s piece that isn’t, well, quite spot on. Let’s also put aside the reality that our politics is quite often dominated by who-knows-who so to raise their relationship is to raise one’s naivety. I do offer that with some considerable respect.
None of this will ever distract from this: Phil Goff’s approach to this was Don Brashesque.
“Phil Goff should be lined up and shot.”
When one views the entire context it was perfectly legitimate – even if the choice of language was misguided. The context was that if Harawira should leave parliament for bad language, as suggested by Goff, then Goff should be lined up and shot for the Labour government’s Foreshore and Seabed Act.
He was saying that by comparison, what he did was nothing when held against that Act. Is he wrong? I don’t think so.
Phil Goff responded by blowing the quote well out of proportion. He reverted to conservative spin, the same conservative lines which support a view toward M?ori which can be summed up as, ‘get over it.’
Through his words, through his cheap response, through his choice to sound like another-Tory rather than a leader of the left who is willing to sound out their own language, he has allowed the views of those uninformed members of the public to be further embedded.
The other real politic remains that the M?ori Party is obviously looking for a scapegoat. They’re prepared to sacrifice Harawira to get one. If Harawira goes, the M?ori Party is the M?ori Party no longer.
I’m sorry to see that you’ve missed the sticks and stones.
Thank-you Flapjack. It needed to be said. There is an excellent post over on The Standard by lprent “I don’t give a s..t about Hone. But the lynch mob is interesting”. Last week Phil Goff seemed to pander to that ‘lynch mob’.
By all means comment on developments, but stay out of the fight Labour!
I thought Matts article was a good summation of what the issues are – I was suprised and a little disappointed in Goff when he went and called him out. Strategically, it was a mistake imo – people I have discussed it with, who could not give a donkeys butt about Hone thought Goff looked desperate and sadly lacking. While Key was quietly brushing it off, and much softer in his response – it did appear far more balanced than Goffs.
As I have stated before – the way to deal with the Nats – esp Key – is to pick battles carefully and to not come out looking petty and desperate to say anything that ‘might’ sway public. Pandering to the white rednecks via his words was where the mistake happened. He would have been better off saying (much like Key):
- “I found what he said out shooting me silly – obviously he was still upset and looking for a target – I don’t think it was personal.
- I am sure the Maori Party and the people who voted for him will deal with it.
- I was disappointed with his colourful comments – its unfortunate that he came off looking like a racist when I am sure he just wants what is best for the people who voted for him.
- Its unfortunate he misused his position to go off on a side trip – I am sure the MP leadership will deal with it.”
Period! Should have left it there, with a few key messages rather than looking like a desperate headline grabber with sour grapes. Unless Goff can figure out how to up his ante, he will not be able to lead the Labour team to victory. It frustrates me as someone who wants to see Labour back in, to watch these political mistakes happen.
The fact is we need these guys standing up for Maori, especially as the ‘independent’ Maori voice of the Maori Party are heavily conservative and have been proved to be sell outs to their own people for ministerial portfolies. I don’t condone Hone Harawira’s actions at all, and I think alot of the time his family is only negative but the things that he stands for are only debated in public because of people like him, Jackson, McCarten etc.
They are the leaders of Maori intrests, not Tariana Turia in cohorts with John Key. The Maori Party are flaud… Maori should vote Green, who have the strongest pro-Maori policy.
I think someone needs to ask Hone if he really does hate white m/fs and everything we have given them. It’s amusing the very thing that started his tantrum was his visit to a beautiful place built by evil white m/fs.
Sure, they had stuff taken and weren’t treated fairly, but what country in history hasn’t experienced this? Would you really want to be living like you were in the 1800’s Hone? I don’t think so.
“And fifth, the topic I will focus on today, is the dangerous drift towards racial separatism in New Zealand, and the development of the now entrenched Treaty grievance industry. We are one country with many peoples, not simply a society of Pakeha and Maori where the minority has a birthright to the upper hand, as the Labour Government seems to believe.”
Don Brash at Orewa
Ahhh isnt that kind of Marxist and ANTI-racist?
It was considered anti-racist when we said it about South Africa – where the minority whites who were there first supposedly had special priviledge over the majority who immigrated there later from Zimbabwe.
When the British, who enjoy 2nd class citizenship behind priviledged immigrants and asylum seekers are told the same thing, it is considered racist, Nazi and fascist for the BNP to even dare call themselves indigenous.
It doesnt matter which side of the issue white people find themselves on we are always the ‘racists’ there is your institutional racism right there.
And lets stop the lies about 63 million acres of land being ‘confiscated’ from Maori (that means ALL privately and crown owned lands). Nonsense. If some Maoris decided to sell land that wasnt theirs to sell thats Maori ripping off both other Maori AND the crown. With ultimately, the crown paying twice over (and in cold hard cash, not the old blankets and muskets lie).
However, if the Maori peoples view on self determination does not jibe with their leaders of old, who signed the treaty, we should respect that. Lets have a referendum and ask the Maori people as opposed to their leaders – self determination or multiculturalism? Its their right to decide but they cant have both.
Withdrawal is not really such a big thing. It was done in Rhodesia, India and many other places. We can call the development of the nation our gift to Maori and like honourable Aryans, make a friend instead of having an enemy. Asset compensation and repatriation programs can be negotiated. No big deal.
And thats coming from a white nationalist, aka racist, fascist, nazi, right wing extremist etc
“Would you really want to be living like you were in the 1800’s Hone? I don’t think so.” First of all, I agree with that.
Secondly, it isn’t the trip or the subsequent email but the fact that Hone thinks that he and other maori should be held to a different standard because of what happened 200 years ago. Hone belives that he can rip off the taxpayer now because white mofos raped their land 200 years ago. That is the most disturbing part of this entire saga. He didn’t do this just once but several times. He even put it in nicer terms, just to clarify with everyone that that’s what he thinks.
Thirdly, Hone went out of his way to call Goff a “bastard”. I listened to Goff’s performance of Radio Live with Willie and JT. I thought that he did alright. If he said nothing then he would look weak. Goff quickly dismissed the Shoot Goff comment as a poor choice of words and then went on to say that the foreshore seabed thing is a) a sideshow that misses the point and b) that it could be improved but it does not justify what Hone did.
This is what he needed to say. Key’s response to everything now days seems to be “I’m relaxed about it” or someone else will deal with it. Goff was addressed directly by Hone and he responded appropriatly.
He was not as outraged as Michael Laws, for example but he was outraged just enough. Good job Goff.
For a party that gets a quarter of the Maori vote their actual support is very limited. And Harawira is a roadblock to them going beyond that.
Hone and the Maori Party are not correct though about the Foreshore and Seabed Act, and so his comments about Phil Goff are way out of line. The politics of the time was the ugly thing, not the Act as it finally was (although the first drafts weren’t that great). Maori never owned the foreshore and seabed, so it wasn’t a land grab – and the Act provides very broad powers for Maori to control stretches of foreshore they have always exercised controls over. Everyone seems to forget what the Nats said at the time.
I bet John Key will make a bunch of sleight-of-hand promises to Maori, and they will end up with less than they have now – but if Hone is not in the Maori Party there will be no one left-of-centre enough in the Maori Party caucus to cast doubt. Tariana and Pita will just swallow up the bait and end up leaving Maori high and dry. That’s why John Key is supporting Tariana in this row – he knows it will benefit him in the Foreshore debate to come.
I thought the piece was disgraceful, harawira was terribly racist and offensive and I’m glad Goff had the stones to say so.
Oh yeah, Goff didn’t look desperate, he came across well.
I think Labour have good pro Maori policies, look at the closing the gaps thing.
I like you Paul. “While Key was quietly brushing it off, and much softer in his response – it did appear far more balanced than Goffs.” – But I disagree with this one point, Goff said that he didn’t take the B****** and the shooting thing too seriously, I think that showed balance.
Crikey. Is Alf Garnett – sorry, Alfred Rosenberg – for real? Or are his comments meant to be a joke? If the former then they’re coming out of the woodwork now aren’t they.
@Anne, if that’s a joke, it’s a pretty scary one. I don’t like racism in either direction, it’s frightening.
Goff also got really good feedback from the public for his stand, I think he did the right thing. I’m hungry, later bloggers.
Clare how about actually backing up your post with specific things you disagree with from Matt’s article? I thought his article was a great analysis of the situation, better than Phil Goff’s populist politicking over the issue in any case.
Spud, you said above “I think Labour have good pro Maori policies…”, and then you mention “I don’t like racism in either direction, it’s frightening.”
I think this sums up NZ’s problems. If only it were one law for all, no Maori electoral roll, one person one vote, we would be much better off in the long run.
Spud says:
November 15, 2009 at 7:02 pm
I think Labour have good pro Maori policies, look at the closing the gaps thing,. So where are the outcomes of this policy?
So why under lastely Lab but previous admin statistically have Maroi going nowhere, say in education or health to give 2 examples. Under the 2last 2 lab govts the gap of poor-rich has widened. Nice to see outcomes that assist the supporters.
Why was not the court allowed to judicate if there was an ownership issue with the F&S and to what extent was any ownership. How is potentially taking away rights assisting Maori?
@Herodotus- How is giving Maori extra rights helping NZ. And do you seriously think that things for Maori are going to improve under National. Maoridom has bigger fish to fry than the F&S. The “holier than thou” attitude has to go. Get with the times.
“Why was not the court allowed to judicate if there was an ownership issue with the F&S and to what extent was any ownership. How is potentially taking away rights assisting Maori?”
It was to ensure that New Zealander’s rights to use the beach were not compromised. I dont know about you, but I am not going to stand by and watch the iwi elite destory our sacred kiwi tradition of a day at the beach.
There was no giving extra rights, Maori were asking a valid question to be answered in court, who knows the outcome may have been that there are no rights. Re improvement under Nats, all that I think can be given is assistance where Maori underperform and as a group resources can be targeted to obtain greater outcomes. If Maori(Or any other ethnic/socioeconomic group) are underperforming becasue of cultural/socioecon issues, examine what within this group is holding them back and find away through this.
Maori have given their support to Lab traditionally so why has not Maori succeeded or improved as a consequence of this support?
No, the iwi elite wanted to grab out beaches and kick off New Zealand families.
It was Labour that gave the Maori people access to our health and education systems, as well as jobs and protections for workers. The reason why Maori fell behind is because Rogernomics gutted industries where there was predominant Maori employment.
labour of the pre 1980’s and post 1980’s could be considered by many to be 2 different parties. So what has happened for Maroi post 1987 or more importantly 99-2008. There is some ugly reading regarding Maori.
Why do you call it Rogernomics why not refer to the period as the 4th Labour Govt, there is some spin and disassociation by the Rogernomics phase. I did not vote for the Rogernomics party the tick went against Labour.
Why do you call it Rogernomics why not refer to the period as the 4th Labour Govt, there is some spin and disassociation by the Rogernomics phase. I did not vote for the Rogernomics party the tick went against Labour.
Other comments in moderation !!!
I think on the whole Labour has done well by Maori, sure some mistakes, but on the whole good.
For me this episode has really lifted my view of Goff.
Until last week he came across to me as very much a machine politician. COmpetent but not particularly inspiring. The only glimpse of inspiration came from his passionate critique of the decision to deploy SAS to Afghanistan.
But last week we saw a man prepared to stand up for all NZers and say no to racism. Thank goodness he was brave enough to do it.
It’s amazing to see people trying to say he was denying the point Hone was making about colonization. Clearly he wasn’t. He was demanding a more mature political discourse where we don’t call each other names, use nasty racist jibes or try to pass the buck.
Good to hear him criticise Winston on the radio too. A leader prepared to call out racism wherever it comes from.
If only we had a PM who was brave enough to do the same.
We could in 2011….
Such a long way away…………
@ Harry Renouf.
I stand with those commentators from both the blogosphere and the MSM who believe Hone’s outburst was stupid and sexist rather than racist but let’s put that aside now.
Greenfly said earlier on this post “Forget sniping at Hone, it’s Tariana causing the damage…”. I recommend you read Shane Jones’s piece in today’s NZ Herald under the heading: ‘Harawira just saying what Party seniors believe.’
It is insightful and comes from someone with a far greater understanding of the underlying issues than most.
Sexist? What was sexist about it? Just curious, I think it was racist, but you’ve got me curious about the sexism thing.
@ spud
Hone’s expression “white mother f…..s” comes across to me as more sexist than racist. Bear in mind also that it was Buddy Mikaere who introduced the term “white mofo” into the email exchanges. Harawira – stupidly – enlarged upon it in his reply. That is my understanding of what happened anyway.
The second part of my comment is more important. If you havn’t already done so, go online and read Shane Jones’s analysis in today’s Herald. Quite revealing.
Okay, will read later and tell you what I think.
Chris Trotter just put up his thoughts about this post on his blog – and took it down.
I’m going to read it in the morning, I’m too tired to do it now.
Ummm….he took it down 5 mins after he put it up. Im probably the only person in the country who read it.
(Im on 2 weeks of leave from my job and have nothing else to do)
Okay, what the heck. So Turia holds racist beliefs too, but she is being more cunning. That’s the message that I got from the article.